Sunday, June 10, 2007

BBC: Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban

Every time I read HP it feels like the boundary between real life and fantasy begins to blur. I can’t help but wonder if there’s really this magical world that coexist with our own. That since I’m a Muggle, *sniff* I wouldn’t know about it. It just so happen I was fortunate to discover J.K. Rowling’s writings.

Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban is my favorite in the series. SS talks about immortality and people’s pursuit of it, immoral or not; COS talks about racism and the significance of bloodlines. In POA, there’s the injustice of a legal system, duality of life and the importance of loyalty. I loooove everything about it: Lupin, who, before the movie, I used to imagine as Christian Bale :P (I came to love Sirius in the future books but not particularly in POA); Hogsmeade, those Animagus stuff, that the simple cure for a dementor’s attack is chocolate *g* and all the foreshadowing that leads to the defining conflict of the book—it is simply SUPERB.

Now here are the questions for us to discuss:
  • Discuss the power of the unseen, the absent, the disappearing and shadows that all play significant roles. How does the author use foreshadowing to prepare the reader for the story’s defining conflicts? Consider, for example, Lupin’s secret identity, Black’s innocence and Hermione’s tricks of time.
  • Sirius Black is imprisoned for 12 years in Azkaban, and Pettigrew is imprisoned for the same amount of time in the body of a rat. Which character was more truly the prisoner? What does it mean to be imprisoned?
  • Considering the nature of the events, do you think Harry was right in leaving Pettigrew alive? Why or why not?
  • Why do you think Harry and Hermione are allowed to tamper with Buckbeak and Black, but absolutely nothing else when they travel back in time?

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45 comment(s):

Blogger Harlot said...

Sorry the questions are late. I was so tired yesterday i just lied down on the bed and i fell asleep and didn't woke up till this early morning. :S Anyway, as always, looking forward to have a good discussion with you guys. :D

6/10/2007 12:19:00 AM  

Blogger Harlot said...

1. There are too many "the unseen, the absent, the disappearing and shadows" in this book. Take this quote as an example:

"You think the dead we loved ever truly leave us? You think that we don't recall them more clearly than ever in times of great trouble? (...) You know, Harry, in a way, you did see your father last night. You found him inside yourself."

I think Harry is always aware of his parents' death. In HP3 it's been overshadowed a bit by his concern about a madman (Sirius) who is after him. That night the dementors attack, he sees someone that looks somewhat like his father and he immediately thinks it's James, even if he knows that his father is dead. I know that in the wizarding world few things are impossible but i think Harry has began to hope that, maybe, like Sirius and Peter, his parents could have secretly escaped.

2. It's cruel to be in jail (especially for 12 YEARS!) when you're innocent. But Sirius, i think he willingly stayed in Azkaban. He's spent 12 years in Azkaban because he believes he's to blame for the Potters death. He could have escaped all those years, but being in Azkaban is his punishment for himself.

Peter, on the other hand, he's been living as a rat. He's done it, not willingly (unlike Sirius; who wants to live as a rat???) but because he's afraid and it's his way of hiding from people who might want to do him harm. In a way, Peter is the one who is truly the prisoner.

3. Were i the one in Harry's shoes, i don't think i could have had the self-control, power, presence of mind and maturity :S to spare Peter, particularly that instance when Harry has found out everything. But i think Harry is right.

"He can go to Azkaban... but don't kill him. (...) I don't reckon my dad would've wanted them to become killers--just for you."

4. Hmmm, this i don't know. :S Have to think about this.

6/10/2007 02:46:00 AM  

Blogger Isabella said...

1. I think most of us have some issues or afraid of the unseen. It's something we don't know, something unfamiliar. God, the future...

In HP3, nothing is what it seems, everything has two sides. In a magical world, where time can be changed, we have to believe that both of them can be true.

2. I agree with Harlot. I think Peter is more of a prisoner than Sirius. I feel so bad for Sirius though. And imagine if Harry grew up with him instead of the Dursleys.

3. Peter will have to play some role in the end. He has to. Dumbledore said that because Harry has saved Peter, Harry is now connected to him. That Peter is indebted to Harry.

4. Harlot mentioned the injustice of the legal system. I think it's just a matter of righting the wrong. I don't think the Ministry of Magic would care even if they find out that Sirius is innocent. Fudge says at one point how bad losing track of Black will look for them. People are being framed, yet the system won't bother to notice.

6/10/2007 10:42:00 AM  

Blogger Isabella said...

I think the main theme of the 3rd book is friendship and loyalty. Look at the way Ron and Hermione quarrel because Crookshanks appears to have eaten Scabbers. What about James, Sirius, Lupin and Pettigrew? It all comes down to Peter betraying his friends.

6/10/2007 10:48:00 AM  

Blogger Danielle De Barbarac said...

-- Nothing is black and white. We see Lupin, a very gentle and respectable professor who turns to be a werewolf. Even the way Snape temporary replaces Lupin when the latter is "sick", it's not only because he has always wanted to be the DADA teacher but also because he wants the class to learn how to recognize werewolves. It's obviously aimed for them to know Lupin's identity and to cause uproar by scaring the students that will surely lead to the school firing Lupin.

-- I think it's Peter too. How hard it must be to live like a rat when you're a wizard? Just the confinment, pretending to be something else...

-- I trust Dumbledore is right (he's always right, LOL). He says that since Harry has saved Peter, Peter owes his life to Harry. That when a wizard saves another wizard's life, it creates a certain bond between them. Maybe in the end, Peter will be forced to save Harry or something like that.

6/10/2007 03:38:00 PM  

Blogger Danielle De Barbarac said...

I really love the Weasley twins. I kept laughing when they're making of Percy. That part when Mr. Weasley gets them a car from the Ministry and the twins tell Percy it's for him. And there will be little flags on the hood. LOL. Cracks me up.

Harlot, I too like that the simple cure against a dementor's attack is chocolate, but that the difficult cure is a happy thought.

6/10/2007 03:43:00 PM  

Blogger Danielle De Barbarac said...

BTW, the witch in the magical pets store asks whether Ron's rat is magical or not. Does that mean animals in the wizarding world are magical too like their owners? How did Percy get Scabbers in the first place anyhow.

6/10/2007 03:51:00 PM  

Blogger Harlot said...

RE: I think the main theme of the 3rd book is friendship and loyalty

Friends are always important. For one thing, without them, there are many things that are hard to get through or we won't be able to get through. :)

I understand how hard it must be for Harry when he finds out that Sirius betrayed his best friend, Harry's dad. That's just bad. And then it turns out that it's been Peter who had done it instead.

I like that part when Lupin and Sirius are confronting Peter:

"YOU SHOULD HAVE DIED!" roared Black. "DIED RATHER THAN BETRAY YOUR FRIENDS, AS WE WOULD HAVE DONE FOR YOU!"

I think the message that's repeated the most in this book has been said by Hagrid:

"I gotta tell yeh, I thought you two'd value yer friend more'n broomsticks or rats."

6/10/2007 04:20:00 PM  

Blogger Harlot said...

Danielle, i have no idea. I wonder what are Crookshanks' magic powers. Or Trevor's LOL.

6/10/2007 04:25:00 PM  

Blogger Polly King said...

--I find all that foreshadowing very clever. JKR is not misleading the readers. She gives us facts but at the same time she tells us what the characters are thinking or feeling and that diverts us from seeing the true situation. For example, the sneakoscope. Through Ron, JKR gives us a presentation of it:

definition: "if there's someone untrustworthy around, it's supposed to light up and spin"

Bill's interpretation: "it's rubbish and sold for wizard tourists and isn't reliable" (Bill doesn't believe it and thinks it's crap)

Ron's interpretation: it works because "Fred and George had put beetles in his soup" (Ron believes it works but attributes the wrong reason for its warning)

fact: the sneakoscope lit up at dinner because presumably Scabbers was there (it works as defined)

Jo is alerting us that that there is something wrong at that dinner table. She may not tell us what (that would spoil the story), but she's not trying to 'fool' us either... all the facts are there.
It's for us to figure it out.

--I don't know why Harry and Hermione are not allowed to tamper with nothing else but the matter of Buckbeak and Sirius.

Wizards are always hiding themselves from Muggles, who would be alarmed by the existence of anything that they couldn't simply explain. When Harry and Hermione time travel, they are themselves but also watching themselves at the same time. The time traveling Harry and Hermione are not allowed to interfere, keeping themselves out of sight as to not alarm other wizards. It makes a good point about humans. We fear what we can't fit into the rational scheme of life: Muggles who know nothing of magic, and other wizards, who know only magic within their reality.

6/10/2007 05:14:00 PM  

Blogger Lorelei said...

I think it's human nature to fear what we can't see, things we don't know of, things we are not familiar with.

One of the reasons why I love this series is because it's very unpredictable. We see Lupin, the best DADA ever, and he turns out to be a werewolf, and also one of James Potter's best friends - who, unbeknownst to everyone, was an Animagus - and he and his friends created the Marauder's Map! The same goes for Sirius, who turns out to be innocent.

I would never have thought Scabbers is a wizard. When the big black dog (Sirius) grabs Ron and drags him under the Whomping Willow, I never thought it's because of Scabbers. Anyway I agree with everyone that it's not Sirius who's been the prisoner but Peter.

Now, I don't see how a traitor and a coward like Peter Pettigrew could ever be anything but a hindrance to Harry's quest to destroy Voldemort. But Dumbledore is always right. Whatever bond it is that binds Harry and Peter, it must be something like the one Harry and Voldemort have, because Lily sacrificed herself for her son.

Isn't it funny that Harry's prediction that Buckbeak would fly away came true? :p

6/10/2007 06:16:00 PM  

Blogger Isabella said...

Polly, that's a good one! Yeah, i never thought JKR is misleading us. She draws us more into the story by letting us feel what the characters feel and think. Anyway, i think this kind of stuff is why it's fun to reread HP.

6/10/2007 07:01:00 PM  

Blogger Danielle De Barbarac said...

"YOU SHOULD HAVE DIED!" roared Black. "DIED RATHER THAN BETRAY YOUR FRIENDS, AS WE WOULD HAVE DONE FOR YOU!"

Harlot, I like the confrontation scene too. Everything suddenly falls into place. I agree with Isabella that nothing is what it seems, especially not in the wizarding world.


Polly, good catch! In HP books, it's hard to guess who the bad guy is, although Jo gives us hints along the way.

I was wondering why Lupin didn't tell Harry that he and James were friends. I just thought that could have saved Harry some trouble.

6/10/2007 07:02:00 PM  

Anonymous Gabrielle said...

I love PoA.


1- I think that this is the first book that JKR really linked a lot of things up. There are so many different little plots that add up to this great big one. From the beginning I think that you can feel that this book is so much darker than the first two. And the unseen, the absent, the disapperaing and the shadows play this big role that make Harry fear for his life constantly. The Grim for example as well as Sirius escaping make Harry feel unsafe.


2- Sirius by far. He was innocent and Pettigrew was hiding with Ron. He was fed and treated properly while Sirius was locked behind bars with the dementors. I feel absolutly no pity for Peter. Sorry guys but I truly beleive that Sirius had it worse. Peter was a rat because he was a coward. He didnt have the courage to escape and join with Voldemort becuase he thought his master was dead. So he stayed with Ron.
Yes, Sirius was punishing himself for a murder he didnt commit but felt responsible for. What he was doing was honourable compared to Peter and I think he had a worse time at it. When he escaped it was for revenge. And in the end he didnt even get that! Sirius was a different man after he came out of Azkaban. He had changed. Pettigrew didnt. He was still a grovelling unrepentant rat (excuse the pun). I cant remember who said it but they said something like Peter always hangs out with the strongest perso in the playground. And when they forced him to become human again you saw it straight away. At least Peter didnt have bars containing him inside his prison, it was his cowardice.

Sirius was a true prisoner. He lost 12 years of his life and Peter was to blame.

Okay, I love Sirius and hate Peter so I had my rant :D

3- I think that Harry was honourable in leaving Peter but I still wanted him to be punished A LOT. I agree that he will play a role in the end but it was still frustrating to see him escape.

4- Buckbeak was the only thing that needed to be fixed. They could save Buckbeak and Sirius simultaneously so anything else wouldve been dangerous and the consequences would have been bad.

6/10/2007 07:25:00 PM  

Blogger Isabella said...

"Sirius was a different man after he came out of Azkaban. He had changed. Pettigrew didnt."

Gabrielle, when you put it that way, I think I have to agree. LOL (And I believe Sirius is the one who says Peter likes big friend who'd look after him.)

I feel so sad about Sirius. It's just... after everything that happened to him, I wanted something really good for him, something that would make up for all the injustice he had experience. Instead... I know I shouldn't mention book 5 but it's just too sad.. :(

6/10/2007 07:44:00 PM  

Anonymous Gabrielle said...

Isabella I completely understand how you feel. I won't mention book 5 either lol but I will say I dont think thats it... I dont want to give away too much so you probably wotnt get what Im talking about...
Okay I'll stop there :D Its just so hard to resist.

6/10/2007 08:50:00 PM  

Blogger Jolie said...

1. I agree with Gabrielle that there are many different plots in book 3, all trying to hint at something but in the end add up to this great big one. The most prominent plot is the one with Sirius and the "grim".

JKR always tries to tell us something but usually in subtle ways as to let the mystery build. In book 3, there are many misguided perceptions that's why it's so surprising that the real villain is the one who's living all the while in Ron's pocket.


2. I'm not sure. My view is colored because I love Sirius and because that sniveling rat is really detestable.

I think there was a time Sirius just gave up. Do you think if he didn't see Peter in the newspaper and was compelled to protect Harry, he would remain in Azkaban? It seemed the only reason he escaped was to remove Peter from Harry's side.


3. What Harry did, sparing Peter's life, it was honorable, very noble. He did the right thing think but I still want Peter punished - I really want that!

Compare to the first two books, in HP3 we see a lot of development in Harry's character. He's more mature, more sure of himself, etc. Even in the beginning of the book, we see these changes. In HP1, Hagrid rescues him from the Dursleys. In HP2, Ron and the twins rescue him. In HP3, he sets himself free. He has more confidence in himself being a wizard and he acts when someone crosses the line (like Aunt Marge insulting his parents).


4. I agree with Gabrielle, because it's the only thing that needed to be fixed. You have to wonder though, when someone really important dies, someone who makes the world a better place or something, why can't they travel back in time to save this person? I think if there's any good reason to break time traveling laws, it's that one.

6/10/2007 09:15:00 PM  

Blogger Jolie said...

LOL. Gabrielle and Isabella, I'm trying not talk about book 5 too! I too want something MORE for Sirius. More happiness... Hopefully JKR would give Sirius exactly that in HP7.

6/10/2007 09:21:00 PM  

Blogger Petra said...

Good discussion ladies. I love PoA too. Here's what I can offer:

RE: I was wondering why Lupin didn't tell Harry that he and James were friends. I just thought that could have saved Harry some trouble.

I think it's because of the way Harry's parents died. If Lupin starts talking about his friendship with James and Lily, I would imagine he'd talk about Sirius too. Maybe he just didn't want to lie about it. Or maybe it's because most people are trying to protect Harry by not telling him the scope of Sirius "betrayal". Even Mrs. Weasley thinks Harry should be sheltered from knowing about what happened. There's also the fact that it's not easy for Lupin to talk about James and Sirius. They were his best friends and he thinks one betrayed the other to death and another killed by the other.

And of course, it's all about JKR foreshadowing. :)


RE: Does that mean animals in the wizarding world are magical too like their owners?

Probably. But here's what I know about Crookshanks and why he is special.

Crookshanks is part Kneazle (Nr), which accounts for his unusual intelligence and his ability to identify suspicious characters, most notably Pettigrew when disguised as Scabbers (PA). But he also recognizes and disapproves of cheating, judging by the way he stared at Harry and Ron when they were making up answers on their Divination homework (GF14). (source: HP Lexicon)

6/10/2007 11:09:00 PM  

Blogger Petra said...

RE: Isn't it funny that Harry's prediction that Buckbeak would fly away came true?

I forgot about that! Yes it is funny. Especially when Professor Trelawney is a big fake and has never, or rather rarely uttered a real prediction. LOL.


RE: Buckbeak was the only thing that needed to be fixed.

I find Hermione and Harry's time traveling very frustrating. I mean I know they saved Buckbeak and Sirius lives but I don't see anything getting fixed in that. The main problem is the injustice upon Sirius but in the end, he is still considered dangerous and a murderer, and Peter who actually is dangerous and a murderer, is loose again.

6/10/2007 11:18:00 PM  

Anonymous Gabrielle said...

Petra, I know what you mean. But then we have to realise that if Buckbeak and Sirius hadnt escaped then worse things wouldve happened. Sirius wouldve been Kissed and Buckbeak beheaded. Its frustrating to see that Sirius wasnt found innocent but at least he gets to live. And with Peter getting loose hes now in Harry's debt. So that has to come back later on. Dumbldore HAS to know what hes talking about.... I dont want to think about it if hes wrong :(

6/11/2007 12:53:00 AM  

Blogger Petra said...

Gabrielle, it's so unfair, isn't it? :( But you're right. The end of the book ties up neatly, but it feels heavy and frustrating.

It's interesting how Buckbeak and Sirius share the same situations. Although I fear that Buckbeak may have gotten a better bargain than Sirius ever did.

6/11/2007 01:35:00 AM  

Blogger Harlot said...

Loving our discussion you guys! Polly, that's nice sleuthing. :D


Gabrielle, good point about Peter and Sirius and who's the real prisoner. And yes, Peter is still the same slimy rat that he's always been! But Jolie says what i've been thinking. It's as if it's easy for Sirius to escape Azkaban, yet he didn't do it, not until he found out about Peter. :/


I was wondering why Lupin didn't tell Harry that he and James were friends.

I agree with what Petra said. And it's seems like Lupin doesn't want to talk about Sirius and James.

"Professor Lupin, if you knew my dad, you must've known Sirius Black a well." Lupin turned very quickly. "What gives you that idea?" he said sharply.
"Nothing--I mean, I just knew they were friends at Hogwarts too..."
Lupin's face relaxed. "Yes, I knew him. Or I thought I did. You'd better be off, Harry, it's getting late."


There's this one too:

"When they get near me... I can hear Voldemort murdering my mum." Lupin made a sudden motion with his arm as though to grip Harry's shoulder, but thought better of it.

6/11/2007 02:30:00 AM  

Blogger Harlot said...

Reading all this talk about Sirius, it seems so silly but i feel suddenly sad. :( I really love Sirius now (yes, more than Lupin). I too HAVE to believe that something better is in store for him. And JKR better not kill Lupin! :@

Anyway, i can't talk about Sirius and Lupin without mentioning the Animagus stuff. I thought it's BRILLIANT; i really love all that.

I love that part towards the end of the book when Lupin becomes a werewolf and Sirius transforms to keep Lupin from hurting anyone, as he must have done countless of times before. And then even after he's injured:

"Sirius, he's gone, Pettigrew transformed!" Harry yelled. Black was bleeding; there were gashes across his muzzle and back, but at Harry's words he scrambled up again...

How can you not love Sirius? He's sharp around the edges but he's extremely loyal and deeply brave. And we all know he would do anything for Harry.

I find it very interesting the way the Animagus thingy also brings us a glimpse of Hogwarts' past. It even extends to Harry since he is now the owner of the Marauder's Map, which i doubt would have been created if James and his friends didn't learn to become Animagus. They wouldn't have experienced all the things they had. Not to mention, Sirius would probably be dead by now or insane in Azkaban if he couldn't transform into a dog, and Peter couldn't escape if he's not able to transform himself into a rat.

6/11/2007 02:53:00 AM  

Anonymous Ollenska said...

"I really love Sirius now (yes, more than Lupin)"

Harlot, even if you still imagine Lupin as Christian Bale? :-P

I love the Animagus stuff too. I think it's interesting how wizards turn into an animal that reflects their personality. For example:

Sirius: dog - brave, loyal, friendly, gruff but very caring nature, he would have died for James and Harry

James: stag - powerful, brave, which symbolizes the way he had defied Vodemort

Peter: rat - traitor, parasite

McGonagall: cat - clever, wise

Do wizards have the option to choose which animal they're transforming into? If I were to become an animagus, I want to be a squirrel. LOL. Or an owl, I'd like that.

Olly

6/11/2007 08:29:00 AM  

Blogger Lily Moon said...

Re: injustice of a legal system

I think a lot of politics in the HP books mirror those of JKR's views of our political system. I think that there is a lot of injustice everywhere and JKR wanted us to know that the wizarding world wouldn't be any different. In every society, there is to some degree corrupt, inconsistent, biased and sometimes cruel. Take for instance the dementor's kiss. The fact that they are willing to let a person's soul be sucked out by dementors is disturbing. Dumbledore is right in opposing these creatures.

I think in PoA, Harry still has that idealism about the wizarding world. That shows when he insists that Peter be turned over to the ministry instead of killing him. I hope I'm not being jaded but think about it, would a werewolf, a wanted criminal and three teenagers have been believed even if they had taken Pettigrew to the ministry? I suppose they have a good chance, since at the time, Harry is still the ministry's favorite. But that just shows how biased the system is.

Re: If I were to become an animagus, I want to be a squirrel. LOL. Or an owl, I'd like that.

If I could be an animagus, I'd probably be a cat. I love cats. I'd like to think I'm clever in a way :P I stretch like a cat and I sometimes bitch like a cat. :)

6/11/2007 09:33:00 AM  

Blogger Harlot said...

Harlot, even if you still imagine Lupin as Christian Bale? :-P

Olly, of course! And yes, if you must know, sometimes i still think of him as Christian Bale. :P

Do wizards have the option to choose which animal they're transforming into?

According to JKR:

"No, you can't choose. You become the animal that suits you best. Imagine the humiliation when you finally transform after years of study and find that you most closely resemble a warthog."

But if i could choose.. hmmm.. i think i'd like to be some kind of a pretty bird. :P Um, i'm not really into birds but i'd like to fly. Or maybe a fox since i'm cunning and intelligent. *ahem* And also that way, i can run with Sirius. :D

I think that there is a lot of injustice everywhere and JKR wanted us to know that the wizarding world wouldn't be any different. In every society, there is to some degree corrupt, inconsistent, biased and sometimes cruel.

I also think that the wizarding law is very inconsistent. Harry blows up Aunt Marge but Fudge lets him go without any kind of punishment at all. Compare that to what happens in HP2 when Harry get an official warning concerning the use of magic by underage wizards that could lead to expulsion--when it's Dobby who did it!

In HP4 (just stating a fact, not a spoiler i hope) we learn that Sirius was sent to Azkaban without the benefit of a trial. WTF? Even Buckbeak got one! (Actually, if you think about it Sirius and Buckbeak share many situations together. Draco frames Buckbeak just as Peter frames Sirius.) To top that, the wizarding world is willing to have Sirius' soul be sucked by dementors without any further due process.

Even Buckbeak is a victim of the Ministry's injustice. He is sentenced to death, not because of the merits of his case but because of the pressure of the wealthy Lucius Malfoy.

6/11/2007 12:54:00 PM  

Anonymous Ollenska said...

Harlot, I think a fox suits you ;-)

I agree with Lily Moon and Harlot about the politics in HP. And I agree that it would have been hard for 3 kids, a werewolf and a convicted murdered to prosecute Peter. We should not forget though, that Dumbledore will be on their side. The fact that Peter's alive would throw everything into question, and that would give Sirius a chance to clear his name, only if Dumbledore could have kept him from the dementors long enough.

Buckbeak's case is different. He is a beast. There would be questions such as: what rights does a beast have? But it still comes back as the ministry's fault because Buckbeak's case is about a spoiled kid with a rich parent and how they're able to influence "justice" in their favor. The ministry blames Hagrid for starting with a difficult animal but animals require care in how they are handled. But since Hagrid's a new teacher they blame Buckbeak. They won't blame Draco, who's at fault in all of it for not listening and for being such a brat.

6/11/2007 02:32:00 PM  

Blogger Danielle De Barbarac said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

6/11/2007 04:24:00 PM  

Blogger Danielle De Barbarac said...

Were I to become an Animagus, I'd like to be a horse. In particular, that horse in Harlot's "only my young master can ride me" post!!!!!

6/11/2007 04:33:00 PM  

Blogger Petra said...

Danielle, LOL. Reading the comments and loving the discussion. Now, we all agree that Harry did the right thing in saving Peter's life. According to Dumbledore, Peter is in the debt of Harry Potter. Does that mean there's a debt of life created every time someone saves another person's life?

I think this life-debt thing will play a role in the end. I was just wondering because Harry, Ron and Hermione have saved each others' lives so many times and no one has mentioned this life-debt. Or maybe it only happens when the person doing the saving does not really want to save that other person's life? But doesn't Snape has a life-debt to James Potter because of that time when James saved him from werewolf Lupin? I doubt James cared for Snape but he did risked his life to save him.

6/11/2007 05:46:00 PM  

Blogger Petra said...

If I could be an animagus, I'd like to be a phoenix so I won't die. :P

6/11/2007 05:47:00 PM  

Blogger Jolie said...

Petra, I think it's because Harry, Ron and Hermione are already willing to rish their lives for each other so a debt of life is no longer necessary.

Anyway, there are many funny scenes in this book and it's not just the twins. I always laugh when they are having Divination classes and Harry and Ron predicting fake things!

I really like Hermione in this book. She really comes into her own. She stands up to a professor and takes a course so physically demanding most wouldn't be able to handle it. And she slaps Draco! That was one of my favorite scenes (book and movie). :D

6/11/2007 11:31:00 PM  

Blogger Lorelei said...

Here's what I think:

In regards to the legal system of the wizarding world, I have no doubt that only reason for Buckbeak's conviction was the prejudice against magical creatures. They're not as important as humans and so easier to err on the side of safety. The case of someone like Sirius is to demonize the convict and so to shoot first -- or should I say 'kiss'-- and ask questions later.


Re: Hermione

I agree with Jolie about Hermione in POA. And I really like how JKR shows us so well what Hermione's strength and weaknesses are. I didn't understand why she would take so many classes even when her schedule won't permit it. But I realized, she does it because she is interested, not because she has this desire to prove herself to anyone. She is passionate and wants to know all about magic and Hogwarts. She's irritated at not being good at something, but I think her logical nature would balk at Divination anyway. I really like that part when she storms out of Trewlaney's class. lol


Re: Animagus

How exactly would you become an animagus? Do you need to learn a complicated spell or it's about performing transfiguration?

Sometimes I think Hedwig is an Animagus. lol. Think about her humanistic qualities and her spunk and attitude. But, maybe not.

Anyway Lupin tells Harry, "Your father was always a stag when he transformed." Does that mean that sometimes people transform into different animals? Perhaps the animal that bests suits them at the moment? Maybe he's just speaking imprecisely. But I thought a powerful wizards, Dumbledore for example, can transform into different animals if they want to.

6/12/2007 12:25:00 AM  

Blogger Lily Moon said...

Re: life debt

I agree with Jolie. A good example is the trio's friendship. Ron and Hermione will never be in a life debt to Harry because they're not solely at the mercy of Harry's decision to save them. Because of their friendship, it automatically means he will choose to save them, and that changes the dynamics of the situation a whole lot.

One of the things I am dying to find out (in HP7) is how the magic involving a life debt works.

6/12/2007 02:07:00 AM  

Blogger Lily Moon said...

Re: Hermione

I don't think Hermione cares about what people like Malfoy think about her. Hermione is the cleverest witch in Hogwarts, of her age, and none of them can compete with her brains and aptitude so she simply doesn't need to prove herself.

I felt sad for Hermione when Harry and Ron act like typical boys and are more concerned with a broom and rat than their friendship with her. She has to do Hagrid's case alone on top of her heavy workload. Which leads me into thinking that Hermione would be a good lawyer! :D

Actually I don't think there are lawyers in the wizarding world (are there?) but whatever is the equivalent of it, Hermione would be good at doing that. She alone becomes Buckbeak's legal defense team. I think it greatly helped her to form SPEW later. Hopefully she will somehow make a profession out of it after leaving school.

6/12/2007 02:14:00 AM  

Blogger Harlot said...

Gotta say, i'm looooving our discussion. :D I hope you guys are having fun too and that more will join us. Anyway, i'm in a hurry and will reply to some of the comments/theories later but want to say this before i forget:

One of the things I find interesting (and then very funny) is Snape assigning the werewolf essay hoping some of the students would figure out that Lupin is a werewolf. Did you notice that Lupin assigned his class to write an essay about vampires after that? I want to think it's some sort of retaliation against Snape's nasty essay LOL. I mean if there's a vampire in HP, that's got to be Snape! Surely he's a bat!!

6/12/2007 02:44:00 AM  

Blogger Lily Moon said...

Harlot, that's a good one, I didn't catch that! I agree, there is always a mention of Snape looking like a bat hahahaha... that's funny!

I'm loving the discussion too :)

6/12/2007 03:16:00 AM  

Blogger Harlot said...

I love the Divination classes too LOL. Those are funny. Anyway, i agree about Hermione. I don't think she's trying to prove anything to anyone. That's just her nature, she has a thirst and passion for knowledge.

6/12/2007 05:14:00 PM  

Blogger Virginia said...

I absolutely love this book! It's my favorite in the series.

I sure as hell hope there was a reason for Harry not killing Pettigrew! It HAS to coome back into play at some point--and hopefully in a good way!

6/12/2007 05:28:00 PM  

Blogger Lorelei said...

"I mean if there's a vampire in HP, that's got to be Snape! Surely he's a bat!!"

Lol! That's right! They always say Snape looks like a bat, or hovering like a bat. Anything with a bat and that's Snape!


"She alone becomes Buckbeak's legal defense team. I think it greatly helped her to form SPEW later. Hopefully she will somehow make a profession out of it after leaving school."

Lily, I agree. Hermione will be good at that.

I wonder if Harry would end up as an auror like what he'd wanted before. It seems like he's changed his mind.

6/12/2007 07:49:00 PM  

Blogger Lily Moon said...

I want to think I'm like Hermione. lol At least even a little bit.

Isn't it funny that the fact Harry is closely connected to Sirius is hinted at when Vernon insinuates that Harry and the fugitive Black have a lot in common. If he only knew!

I simply love it that Harry's Patronus is a stag. I read a JKR interview where she's asked what Snape's patronus is and she said that she can't tell because that reveals some plot in book 7. I'll see if I can find it.

6/13/2007 01:50:00 AM  

Blogger Harlot said...

Lily, here's something from JKR:

Ernie: I wonder if you can let us know what form will Professor Snape's Boggart and Patronus take? I am very curious.
JK Rowling replies -> Well, I'm not going to tell you Ernie, but that's because it would give so much away.

I bet Snape's patronus is a bat!

Hmmm, this makes me wonder what my patronus will be, heh. :P

6/13/2007 01:07:00 PM  

Blogger Lorelei said...

Lol. Harlot, you really think Snape is a vampire? :P I think if a wizard is an animagus, whatever his animal form is, that is what his patronus looks like.

6/13/2007 08:31:00 PM  

Blogger Lily Moon said...

Harlot, yes that's the one! :)

Lorelei, I think so too. BTW, Jo said that Dumbledore's animagus was a phoenix. I used to think that he may also have been able to turn into a bee. lol It's because of his name. Dumbledore is an old-fashioned name for bumblebee. He loves to hum and he has an uncanny way of knowing what's going on a lot of time. I just thought he's flying around observing what's going on in Hogwarts. I know it sounds silly but we know of another animagus who turns into a bug!

6/14/2007 01:19:00 AM